Need help with Mark II trigger problem

mwwilkew · Post by **mwwilkew** » Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:22 pm

One more try posting a photo...
Outside of disconnector after several dry-fire's.

Here's a photo of the hammer-side of the disconnector.

Photo of hammer, sear, and hammer bushing. Are these original parts?

Photo of hammer pin hole on disconnector side of frame.

Still experiencing the same problem, however, one time I completely reassembled the pistol and did not experience the problem - I thought it was fixed. The trigger worked evertime I cycled the bolt. Then I noticed that I did not push the hammer pin all the way through the hole on the right side of the pistol during reassembly. It stopped just inside the frame. When I reassembled correctly, I had the problem again. So the problem seems to be located around the bushing. But the Sharpie wear marks did not seem conclussive to me. ???

blue68f100 · Post by **blue68f100** » Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:11 pm

It kind of looks like the corner of the dissconnector that contacts the sear is worn/discolored. Can not tell by the photo if it's contacting the disconnector correctly, need to look at the front edge.

perazzi · Post by **perazzi** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:01 am

BE, is that a defective VQ sear??

Post by **Bullseye** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:29 am

It is definitely one of those VQ bargain bin sears. I see the chip out near the sear pivot pin hole. This doesn't mean the sear is defective. Only the ones that the sear will not release the hammer because the trigger is striking the front of the trigger well are defective. If your sear provides enough trigger travel to adequately release the hammer then it is fine. The chip out is not really a critical part. What is critical is that the pin hole is indexed properly and the sear face is sitting parallel to the hammer hook.

The disconnector shows a lot of wear on the inside, near the tab that engages the sear. Also, the sear appears in the photo to have a rough edge directly above the pin hole chip out. What I'm seeing is very close to the ink from the disconnector tab touching the back of the sear. It could also be a optical illusion from the photo. But if there is a rough edge, then that could be the culprit.

How about the inside edge of the squared disconnector hole; it appears a little rough in the picture, like there's some metal flash around the edge. If you run your finger around it, does it feel rough? If it does, I'd break the sharp edge a little with some light strokes with a very fine needle file.

I also see some interesting scrape marks on the outside rear of the disconnector lever. The ones that make very distinct narrow lines indicate to me that there is something sharp striking the lever, could also be a source of excessive friction. Is that disconnector lever straight?

Not related, but that hammer strut looks like it was cut out with a butter knife. I would use a fine file and dress those edges slightly.

R,
Bullseye

blue68f100 · Post by **blue68f100** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 9:49 am

The sear in my MKIII has the same cutout around the pivot pin, so it's hard to tell without have another one to compare the angle too. Sticking the pin or straight drill bit through may tell you if its straight or not. The obit should be equal distance from the laying surface. If you look closely on the sear you can see some discoloration, a rectangle area along the sears edge.

With the hammer bushing not fully inserted you gave a little more clearance for the disconnector to operate in.

I wonder what the actual sear face looks like? It should have a polish area where the hammer contacts if it has any age on it.

The hammer and bushing looks original. The tip on the hammer strut like you said looks a little rough like it may have not been engaged properly with the main spring. May need to pun some oil on the main spring housing plunger where the strut rides.

Bullseye, Like you said on the disconnector not being flat may be an optical illusion, but it does look like it may be dished.

mwwilkew · Post by **mwwilkew** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 7:11 pm

I'm looking very closely at the suggested spots, will touch up as necessary, and will give an update when done. But, I just realized the "notch" in my sear is actually a chip. Here's a better picture. Could this be the problem or is something else going on?

Post by **Bullseye** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 10:35 pm

That sear should be replaced. That chipped out area is a failure of material not a minor flaw. Is that a VQ sear? At first I thought it was a VQ because of the missing material but now I'm not positive from the picture. I've never seen one of VQ's sears break like that.

If it is a VQ sear then contact them and they will send you a new sear.

My concern was the upper side of the sear, which is out of focus in the new picture and I still cannot see clearly.

R,
Bullseye

perazzi · Post by **perazzi** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 10:41 pm

My uneducated guess is that somethings putting lateral stresses on that sear, thus the chipping away....I know you don't want to be a "parts swapper", but, as BE stated, that needs to be replaced....

blue68f100 · Post by **blue68f100** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 10:42 pm

Bullseye, I think I see the corner you looking at on the out of focus/shaded sear on the first photos. Looks almost like its chipped.

He said he bought the gun used and it's the way it came. So hard to say what parts are in it without seeing them in person to distinguish the finish.

A replacement sear would be a good thing, and add the Clark Bushing to give him a tighter trigger.

Post by **Bullseye** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:05 pm

That deep chamfer in the pin hole is way off for a VQ sear too. I just grabbed a bag of take off OEM sears out of my parts bin and found one with the same deep chamfer on both sides of the pin hole. Could be that the chamfering tool gouged out that chip and the part made it through QC.

That sear just keeps bothering me. The more I look at it, the more I don't like the angle of the sear face. I'd replace it with a Volquartsen sear. That may cure all your problems.

R,
Bullseye

perazzi · Post by **perazzi** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:19 pm

Another sleepless night, eh, BE......

Post by **Bullseye** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:26 pm

Naw, just doing some computer work and checkin' the old site. Lots of maintenance, especially spammer account registrations lately. I deleted 12 in one sitting, and that's on top of the six I weeded out this morning. The Spambots are humming this week.

R,
Bullseye

mwwilkew · Post by **mwwilkew** » Sat Feb 20, 2010 7:52 pm

I checked and the disconnector lever is straight/flat. Picked up some 600 grit sandpaper and touched up the disconnector lever and square hole, the hammer spur, and the hammer pin hole on the right side of the frame. Couldn't find any other spots that needed a touchup..Then I reassembled with no improvement. Next, I took the sear from the MkIII and reassembled the MkII...till no improvement. Still need to rack the bolt, pull trigger back till I hear the "re-set click", then pull trigger again to drop the hammer.

I obviously need to get a new sear, but was thinking about doing the VQ accurizing kit even before I picked up the MkII. Think the VQ kit will resolve this problem?

perazzi · Post by **perazzi** » Sat Feb 20, 2010 9:32 pm

ok, I'm confused a little now, could be age..

With the gun empty, if you hold the trigger back, then rack the bolt,then sloooowly release the trigger, you hear a "click" at that point you can pull and drop the hammer, right???

mwwilkew · Post by **mwwilkew** » Sat Feb 20, 2010 9:47 pm

Well, that's not what I meant, but I tried what you've described and your description is correct. If I hold the trigger down, rack the bolt and then release the trigger...I hear a click. And then the trigger will work and drop the hammer.

The problem I am still having is this...
If I am not holding the trigger and rack the bolt, a pull of the trigger will not drop the hammer. But with that first pull of the trigger I hear the click. The next pull of the trigger will drop the hammer.

Thanks everyong for continuing to follow this and help. What do you think about getting a VQ accurizing kit - would that solve all this?