Winchester model 12

piasashooter · Post by **piasashooter** » Sun Dec 19, 2010 3:16 am

Hi, I have a model 12 that was my grandpa,s that I recently pulled out of the gun safe to go shoot, as I never have in the 6 or 7 years I have had it. The problem is it won't hold shells in the magazine tube. I can sometimes get one to stay in but they usually just shoot right out. Is there anybody here that is familiar with these gun and or the problem I am having. Thanks in advance for any replies.

blue68f100 · Post by **blue68f100** » Sun Dec 19, 2010 10:12 am

If I recall that is similar to a Rem 870. There should be a latch that holds the shells back. I would do a good cleaning, there may be a piece of shot gumming the works up.

Post by **Bullseye** » Sun Dec 19, 2010 12:12 pm

There is a silvery metal tab underneath the shotgun that the shells must pass by insert into the magazine tube. This silver tab is called the cartridge cutoff and is designed to hold the cartridges in the magazine tube. It is located on the right hand side of the receiver opening if you invert the shotgun (trigger upwards) and peer in from underneath. You may need to clean and add a little bit of lubricant to this part to get it to return into the outward position. You can move this cutoff tab manually inward (by squeezing it toward the metal frame of the receiver) and it should return back to the outward position when released. It may be gunked up and in need of a good cleaning.

The cartridge cut off is #29 is this diagram

R,
Bullseye

bearandoldman · Post by **bearandoldman** » Sun Dec 19, 2010 1:29 pm

Loved them OLD unsafe model 12's, 1 in the chamber and 6 in the mag. Pull the trigger and hold it and keep on shucking, an autoloader can not cycle that fast, DZMN, tha's firepower.

piasashooter · Post by **piasashooter** » Mon Dec 20, 2010 1:31 am

Loved them OLD unsafe model 12's, 1 in the chamber and 6 in the mag. Pull the trigger and hold it and keep on shucking, an autoloader can not cycle that fast, DZMN, tha's firepower.

That's the main reason I got it out of the safe, I was reading online, and someone said they hold 6+1. I new the gun was a model 12 but never looked at it much and was unaware of the capacity until recently. With the ability to hold seven rounds it would be a good weapon for the house and fun to go out and shoot.I will have to mess with it and see if I can get it to work. Thanks everyone for the replies.

piasashooter · Post by **piasashooter** » Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:25 pm

After further research on model 12's, I think my cartridge cutoff is working. From what I have been reading, the cartridge cutoff only holds the shells back when pumping the gun. In other words when the forearm is slid back to the receiver the cutoff is holding back any extra shells, but when it is in the forward position the cutoff is not doing anything.Looking at my gun this seems right, because the cutoff can not pivot at all when the forearm pump is in the forward position. I,m pretty sure that a part of the breechbolt is supposed to hold the shells in the mag when the pump is forward. I can get it to hold sometimes if I push the shell in the mag and press down with it to hookup and the part of the breechbolt, but they don,t seat well and will pop out if the gun is moved around. I'm still a little confused with the design of this gun, I guess I will wait until I can talk to more people.

Post by **Bullseye** » Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:22 pm

When the slide is forward the shell carrier should be in the fully downward position. This allows the next shell to feed from the magazine tube onto the carrier and in position for feeding into the breech when the slide is moved rearwards. The old fired case should be extracted by the bolt and the carrier should rotate upward when the slide is move rearward after a shot is fired. Moving the slide forward again will cause the bolt to close and push the next round sitting on the carrier into the chamber. Anytime the carrier is moved upward the cartridge cutoff should be engaged to prevent any of the cartridges in the magazine from sliding out of the bottom of the receiver. Is your carrier functioning properly?

R,
Bullseye

piasashooter · Post by **piasashooter** » Thu Dec 23, 2010 6:08 pm

The shell carrier is working.I took some picture of the slide forward, were the cartridge cutoff in not in position to hold shell is the magazine, and a picture with the slide pulled back, where the cartridge cutoff is in position to hold shells in the magazine. In both pictures I am holding the shell carrier down to take the shots. My question is what holds shells in the magazine with the slide forward, away from the receiver?

The first picture is with the slide pulled to the receiver, cartridge cutoff down. The second picture is with the slide forward, away from the receiver,cartridge cutoff up.

bearandoldman · Post by **bearandoldman** » Thu Dec 23, 2010 6:20 pm

I don/t think it is supposed too, that way the shell will slide back into the carrier to get loaded after you fire and eject, Not sure, have not owned a pump shotgun in many years.

Post by **Bullseye** » Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:20 pm

Do you know if anyone had removed the bolt from the receiver? It is possible that the cartridge cutoff is not properly aligned with the bolt and consequently isn't camming properly to keep the shells in the magazine latched. From the pictures it does not appear that the cutoff is moving far enough to hold the shell cases and prevent overfeeding.

R,
Bullseye