.45ACP crimp for match 1911

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Georgezilla
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.45ACP crimp for match 1911

Post by Georgezilla » Mon May 04, 2009 3:33 pm

I made some SWC ammo that was crimped to .470 - .471. The ammo would drop right in and seat itself in the clean barrel of the 1911 pistol I was using. After the pistol was starting to run in its dirty state the rounds would no longer drop right in. After 90 rounds if I dropped a cartride in, about half the rim of the case would stick out, it took a little pushing to get it fully seated -- and the round would be very hard to pull out with my fingers.

My question is for the best possible accuracy with the best possible reliability what am I looking for in terms of a drop check in a dirty 1911? Should the cartridge drop in and seat all the way with just gravity or should it need a little bit of pushing for a snug fit? I know I will have to answer the accuracy part myself, but I am still curious if there is some sort of loose guide line.

Or is this more due to the OAL?

Thanks.

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Post by Python » Mon May 04, 2009 9:58 pm

I use 200gr LSWC.
Seat them to a thumbnail thickness of the shoulder showing above the case mouth.
I use a separate crimp die adjusted to .469"

With that said, I have had problems with bullets not lubed properly and leaving a lot of lead build up in the chamber from feeding at the 10 to 2 o'clock position causing failures to feed.

Changed my bullets to some with good lube and have not a problem since.

Just for grins as I am sitting here typing this, I went into my gun box and pulled out my RRA wadcutter that has not been cleaned in 420 rounds fired.
Took a reloaded .45 and it dropped right in and fell right out when I tipped it up.

Look for excessive leading of the chamber.
JMHO.

Clarence G. Perkins
2495 Club : )

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Post by stork » Tue May 05, 2009 10:30 am

Georgezilla
What load are you using?
Are the bullets hard or soft?

FWIW
"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” – George Washington

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Post by Georgezilla » Tue May 05, 2009 3:49 pm

Python, there was not too much leading, but I did only shoot 100rounds out of a clean pistol. The crimp I had was about 1.5 thumbnails.

Stork, I was using 200gr SWC, 4.2gr Greendot, Federal large pistol primer #150, Winchester case, OAL of .147" and crimped to .471".

I am not sure if they are hard or soft. The bag does not say -- they are made by the Renegade Bullet Company. If I had to guess I'd say they are in the middle of the road. They don't seem easy to dent but I wouldn't say its hard either. I got them as learner bullets because they were fairly cheap. probably a mistake on my part... A lot of them seem to be poorly cast at the shoulder.

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Post by stork » Tue May 05, 2009 6:50 pm

If a fingernail can make a mark, that's soft enough.
I'd increase the amount of crimp to .468-.469. 470 and .471 I only use for swaged lead bullets.

Don't be too excited about minor flaws on the bullet shoulder. The place that you really need to be anal about is the base. It must be perfect for good 50 yard bullets. Weight variations must be within 3 grains and diameter should be .0005 to .001 over groove diameter.

Your amount of exposed lead at the crimp seems to be right.

This is only a guess, but I'd say your crimp isn't holding onto your bullet hard and long enough for your powder to start effectively burning before it releases the bullet. This is allowing a lot of fouling to develop and saturate the chamber and rifling.

A general rule I follow is soft bullet=soft crimp...hard bullet=hard crimp.

FWIW
"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” – George Washington

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Post by Georgezilla » Tue May 05, 2009 11:53 pm

Stork, I can barely make a mark on these bullets with my nails and it takes some work. I crimped down to .468" as you suggest and I also changed the OAL to 1.238, a little over 1 thumbnail.

So are these V shaped lines on the shoulder acceptable?
Image

I think your guess is probably correct, Stork. The throat and feed ramp were very dirty for only 100 rounds.

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Post by stork » Wed May 06, 2009 12:49 pm

As far as I can see, the bases look ok on the pictures. While I wouldn't use those in match loads, I wouldn't hesitate to use them in practice loads. I generally inspect the bullets I load for match ammo a bit closer than the practice ammo.

Try some of those crimped to .468, but if the bullet is very hard try some crimped to .465. The last Kart barrel I had, loved a really hard crimp .463-.465. My new one doesn't like it quite as hard.
"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” – George Washington

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Post by Georgezilla » Fri May 08, 2009 4:42 pm

Why do you use a soft crimp for softer bullets? I've read this in several places, but haven't found it explained anywhere.

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Crimps

Post by stork » Sat May 09, 2009 6:55 pm

A soft bullet will deform easily. A lighter crimp will deform the bullet less and still hold it in place under recoil while in the magazine.

If you put a really hard crimp on a soft bullet you will actually reduce the diameter of the bullet. Then you have an undersized bullet going down the pipe and leading the barrel to beat the band.

Hard bullet=hard crimp is not always the case. As I posted earlier, my first Kart barrel loved a hard crimp. My current one loves .469-.470,

FWIW
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Post by Georgezilla » Sun May 10, 2009 3:00 pm

I see. This has been a very informative thread for me :) Stork, Thank you very much for answering all my questions and giving me advice -- It will all go to good use!

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