I'm an old high power and smallbore rifle shooter, but a new bullseye shooter....
I'm shooting a bullseye league inside with a Ruger 22/45 with Vol-kit, BSA red dot optic.... not more than 3C invested so far..... groups are tightening up some, and would like to try shooting outside, including .45.
Problem: I'm a retired educator, and my money isn't growing on trees. I have no .45 capable of bullseye, but I have a very good Colt Combat Commander, series 70.......
Could I cobble up a Frankenstein? Maybe a Caspian slide, match-quality barrel with fitted bushing in the Commander? Just enough to try it outside and see if I like it? Opinions?
bullseye CF on a budget.....
Moderators: Bullseye, Moderators
-
cousin jack
- Regular contributor
- Posts: 66
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:43 am
- Location: Ellensburg, Wa 98926
Rather than invest in something that is only temporary and will not perform well you should talk with some of the other shooters in your league and see if one of them would be willing to lend you one of their back-up CF 1911s to see if you want to build your own later. Anyone who's been doing this a while has more than one and is willing to let a new shooter borrow their equipment to play the game. I always bring several to a match and more than a few times I've pulled one out of the box and handed it to someone who's gun broke on the line so they could continue.
R,
Bullseye
R,
Bullseye
commander modifications
Jack,
My first recommendation would be the same as Bullseye's.
Your idea of modifying your commander is very possible but there may be some unintended consequences.
Once you have the slide fitted to your frame (which may require peening your frame rails), your original slide may not fit. Or it may fit tighter, it all depends on where you are starting from, dimension wise.
A few questions.
How well do you want the pistol to be able to shoot at 50 yards? 2" or 4"
How well does the colt shoot now, from a ransom rest with GOOD match ammo? If your favorite bullseye gunsmith has a barrel testing jig, pay him whatever to test the barrel's capability. Otherwise, any work to the original barrel may be money flushed down a rat hole.
How tight is the current fit? frame to slide, bushing to frame, bushing to barrel, hood fit, and slide stop to lugs.
The reason is, some of the old Colt barrels shot well. You may be able to have a match bushing fitted to the barrel and frame, properly fit the slide stop to the lugs, install a dot or good open sights, and have a good trigger job done. This of course, requires the original barrel to be capable of good groups.
If you're using a dot, the barrel length isn't that big a factor. With open sights it will be a much bigger factor.
The reason I would check the original's is this. I sold a friend of mine a Springfield Milspec 1 1/2 yrs ago. My gunsmith and I were both amazed at how tight the frame/slide fit,the barrel hood, and the slide stop to lug fit all were. This pistol needed a trigger job and a match bushing fitted to be capable of 1 1/2" groups at 50 yds with 4.4gr 700x and a 200 gr swc.
This pistol was exceptionally tight to start with, and they normally aren't as well fitted. But, if you watch around and check every one you find, you can find diamonds in the rough.
FWIW
My first recommendation would be the same as Bullseye's.
Your idea of modifying your commander is very possible but there may be some unintended consequences.
Once you have the slide fitted to your frame (which may require peening your frame rails), your original slide may not fit. Or it may fit tighter, it all depends on where you are starting from, dimension wise.
A few questions.
How well do you want the pistol to be able to shoot at 50 yards? 2" or 4"
How well does the colt shoot now, from a ransom rest with GOOD match ammo? If your favorite bullseye gunsmith has a barrel testing jig, pay him whatever to test the barrel's capability. Otherwise, any work to the original barrel may be money flushed down a rat hole.
How tight is the current fit? frame to slide, bushing to frame, bushing to barrel, hood fit, and slide stop to lugs.
The reason is, some of the old Colt barrels shot well. You may be able to have a match bushing fitted to the barrel and frame, properly fit the slide stop to the lugs, install a dot or good open sights, and have a good trigger job done. This of course, requires the original barrel to be capable of good groups.
If you're using a dot, the barrel length isn't that big a factor. With open sights it will be a much bigger factor.
The reason I would check the original's is this. I sold a friend of mine a Springfield Milspec 1 1/2 yrs ago. My gunsmith and I were both amazed at how tight the frame/slide fit,the barrel hood, and the slide stop to lug fit all were. This pistol needed a trigger job and a match bushing fitted to be capable of 1 1/2" groups at 50 yds with 4.4gr 700x and a 200 gr swc.
This pistol was exceptionally tight to start with, and they normally aren't as well fitted. But, if you watch around and check every one you find, you can find diamonds in the rough.
FWIW
"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” – George Washington
-
cousin jack
- Regular contributor
- Posts: 66
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:43 am
- Location: Ellensburg, Wa 98926
Thanks, Gentlemen: Intelligent comments. One of my problems is that we are a very new pistol club; we are an old small bore rifle club which is slowly but inevitably drying up..... people new to the shooting sports aren't necessarily willing to put out $3000 for a new Anschutz, but they seem to be able to handle $300 or so for a new Ruger MkIII.
At least, that's what we thought and we were right: took some club money out of a cd and bought six Rugers for club use. We went from five members to thirty almost overnight! But, I digress.... we are so new that we have only a few members with any true knowledge. We have a former National Guard Master level pistol shooter, and he gave us a clinic last week. He may have an extra .45 and I will ask him next Wednesday. As soon as our snow moderates, I'll also find some match ammo and bench my Commander to see what it does.... it's always met my requirements for a carry gun, but, apples and oranges! The slide actually rattles on the frame! Doesn't hang up that way, you see........ lol........
We'll see....don't know how much I should spend because I'm probably too long in the tooth for it, but, what the heck, huh?
At least, that's what we thought and we were right: took some club money out of a cd and bought six Rugers for club use. We went from five members to thirty almost overnight! But, I digress.... we are so new that we have only a few members with any true knowledge. We have a former National Guard Master level pistol shooter, and he gave us a clinic last week. He may have an extra .45 and I will ask him next Wednesday. As soon as our snow moderates, I'll also find some match ammo and bench my Commander to see what it does.... it's always met my requirements for a carry gun, but, apples and oranges! The slide actually rattles on the frame! Doesn't hang up that way, you see........ lol........
We'll see....don't know how much I should spend because I'm probably too long in the tooth for it, but, what the heck, huh?
I thoroughly support anyone who wants to shoot more but reality dictates that not everyone likes bullseye shooting or shooting Conventional pistols outdoors. Therefore considering spending money on something unknown seems to go against common sense. Try it out first, if not in your small community then branch out. There is a large following in the Emerald State. Puget Sound and Tacoma have fairly strong conventional pistol shooting groups. Ask around, inquire to the Washington State Rifle & Pistol Association see who is conducting bullseye clinics. Try it out then decide. Then once you've investigated the sport spending the money to build a competitive 1911 bullseye gun will be much easier to accept.
R,
Bullseye
R,
Bullseye
-
Pete D.
- Regular contributor
- Posts: 132
- Joined: Fri Dec 11, 2009 8:30 am
- Location: Brooklyn, NY and Pennsylvania
Bulldog
"What exactly do ya got there?"
That is a "British Bulldog" pistol (or just a "bulldog"). They were quite popular in the late 19th Century. That one is in very nice condition. It appears to be a .44. Maybe?
I have one - just got it - in .38 CF. (common chamberings were .32, .38, .44, .45. BP loads.)
Many were made in this country by Forehand and Wadsworth. In Europe there were many sources. The best were by Webley.
Pete
That is a "British Bulldog" pistol (or just a "bulldog"). They were quite popular in the late 19th Century. That one is in very nice condition. It appears to be a .44. Maybe?
I have one - just got it - in .38 CF. (common chamberings were .32, .38, .44, .45. BP loads.)
Many were made in this country by Forehand and Wadsworth. In Europe there were many sources. The best were by Webley.
Pete
"Only hunting and mountain climbing are sports. The rest are just games." - R.Ruark
It is indeed a Belgium (Liege) copy of a "British Bulldog". Unmarked except Liege proof marks. I believe .442 Bulldog, or .44 Webley. Still working on what exactly...
Obviously, a BP only option...
I think it's the one stolen from the Smithsonian that was used to shoot Garfield. (the pres, not the cat!)
Obviously, a BP only option...
I think it's the one stolen from the Smithsonian that was used to shoot Garfield. (the pres, not the cat!)
