45 cal. 1911 purchase

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markIIIronp
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45 cal. 1911 purchase

Post by markIIIronp » Wed Feb 18, 2009 6:30 pm

I am looking for the best buy on a 1911. I am looking at a Kimber Gold Match II and a Colt Gold Cup Trophy. Any opinions on which is the best and most accurate of the two or any other pistol you may think is more accurate? I am talking production guns un-accurized.

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Post by Bullseye » Wed Feb 18, 2009 11:48 pm

My first question is what kind of shooting (style) are you planning to do with these pistols?

I've always have been a fan of the Gold Cup. Used to be that the GC had a weak point - the rear sight's roll pin. But Colt has updated these newer pistols with Champion (Bo-Mar style) rear sights and the roll pins shouldn't fall out of them like they did in the older Colt Gold Cup models. Accuracy with these Colt pistols are acceptable for production guns, especially with wadcutter ammo.

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markIIIronp
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Post by markIIIronp » Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:51 am

Mostly friendly local indoor Bullseye competition without the expense of an accurized pistol. Out of the box stock manufactured accuracy. Kimber or colt or something else in the $1100 price range.

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Post by Adam67 » Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:55 pm

Well I'm doing the same type of shooting you described..... local informal bullseye.

I picked up a Springfield Loaded Target for $825 and could not be happier. Maybe I got lucky but this thing is a real sweet shooter.

It helps that my instructor knows his way around a 1911 and he has done some work on it. I'm using the factory barrel. He got the trigger to a crisp 3.5lbs and installed my Ultra Dot Match Dot (another $130 there) for me as well. We also spent time finding the right wolff recoil spring for the reloads I'm shooting.

I would put this gun up against others costing $100's more. It's holding 2.5" at 50 yards and that is from hand hold bench rest. At 25 yards and indoors the bullet goes right were the dot was aiming when she goes bang......now if I could just keep it on the bullseye :)

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Post by Bullseye » Wed Feb 25, 2009 6:46 am

That's a good way to start and develop your skills. Your Springfield is plenty accurate for the type of shooting you are doing. When your skills improve you'll know if you're outshooting that pistol. Most folks never do outshoot their equipment, but if you do, then you can always invest in a expensive custom made 1" @50yd bullseye gun.

Keep learning all that you can from your coach. Remember if you stick with it someday you'll be the coach.

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Post by Hi Ball » Mon Jun 01, 2009 1:51 pm

Mark......I can tell you that comparing apples to apples the Gold Cup is a real target pistol with a great record backing it up. I used to own a couple, along with a couple of 70 series Colts. However, I now own 3 Kimber pistols and they are very accurate out of the box. They are not 1-inch pistols at 50 yards.

My Kimber target model (one of the very first) will do 2.50 inch groups at 25 yards. The other pistol has done 2.75 inches at 25 yards and the Kimber Carry pistol is 3.5 inches at 25 yards. The Kimber Carry has cut one ragged hole at 21-ft. Me shooting slow fire of course. I am positive those pistols of mine are much more accurate. However, I am far from being a pistol shot as eyes are going South.

I have never shot the Kimber Gold Match and don't really have any information on it at this time but I will ask around. I shot at a range that is a Kimber Dealer. As was mentioned, I don't think your skills are going to out shoot either of those pistols right away anytime soon.

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Post by perazzi » Mon Jan 18, 2010 11:46 am

Check out each gun carefully! I'm sending my ne GC back because the rear sight slot is milled .060 offcenter.

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Post by jayman » Mon Feb 08, 2010 1:44 pm

Hello Foristi,

want to have a look over the ocean?

The biggest german gun magazine tests, always after a couple of years, different weapons.

Here is the list for the most accurate .45 ACP - guns.
Sorry, but not all of them are 1911´s or even american.
Hope you forgive me that.

This tests are an important indicator in the german scene for buying a gun.

Of course they don´t replace taking the guns in your own hand, or best of all, shooting with it before you decide.

It just could be a tip, which guns may be in choice.

The supreme chart is the newest.
The main criteria in the test is accuracy, but they also judge function, handling or a good sight and trigger.

http://www.visier.de/bilder/excel/pistolen_45.htm


Sorry, but I have no idea of the prices for this guns in the U.S.. :oops:

P.S.:
The accuracy is tested with more than ten sorts of ammunition in every test with every gun in the ransom rest, factory and reloaded.

"Punkte" means "points" (Highscore is 100)
"Testurteil" means "test adjudgement"

Here is
"ausgezeichnet" means "excellent"
"sehr gut" means "very good"
"gut" means "good"

"Bemerkungen" means "remarks"

Here is
"Produktion eingestellt" means "production adjusted"
"Keine Bewertung" means "no assessment" (gun had serious malfuntion or a damage while testing!)
"Abwertung wg. Preis" means "depreciation cause of the price" (to expensive in comparison)

I hope this might be helfpful for you.



Oh, the actuallity is 2004!
Seems to be necessaire for an new test in.45.

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Post by Bullseye » Mon Feb 08, 2010 11:42 pm

I'm glad you were kind enough to translate the language for the review. It reminded me of a long time ago, I had a lot of trouble with using my German marked sights on my Anschutz smallbore target rifle. I learned that the 'R' and 'L' stand for "rechts" and "links", the German words for right and left. I also learned that 'H' and 'T' stand for "hoeher" and "tiefer", the German words for higher and lower. I translated them as up and down, as sights are usually marked in English.

I thought everything was fine with making these sight adjustments, because I had learned the German words begin with basically the same letters as their English counterparts, but I was wrong. Even though I learned the directions that the German words meant the sights did not seem to operate the way I believed they should. Each time I made an adjustment correction, I was always going in the wrong direction with my impacts. Later one of my coaches taught me to adjust the sights using "H" is for hell which is always down, and "T" is toward the top. The "L" and "R" windage directions are also reversed by what we English speakers normally think. That's because if you look at the sight you will see in small print the word "bei". It means "if", so bei to the markings on the sight roughly means: "If the bullet impacts left, turn this way." Following the L arrow on the knob will move the bullet impacts to the right. The same went for the 'H' on the elevation knob and why my coach taught me it was down, because "if the hits are high then you want to move the impacts downward."

Later I learned a much better way to adjust German style sights was to memorize which way the point of impact moved with a clockwise turn of the knob. This way I could make adjustments while in position, without having to look at the knobs. All current Anschutz sights move the impacts Left and Down with clockwise knob rotation. One method I teach to new smallbore shooters is the 'Right hand rule" of knob rotation. Using a combination of the fingers and the thumb of the right hand, to tell the direction of bullet impact change. The fingers curled will point clockwise, indicating the direction of knob rotation and the thumb (extended outward) will point either to the left or downward to represent the direction of impact movement; depending on which knob you are turning.

It took me a while to get these right but now I pass it on to my shooting students as they practice to be better shots.

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Post by jayman » Tue Feb 09, 2010 4:18 am

Oh yes,

I know exactly what you mean!
I was accustomed the german sights when I got my first U.S. gun, a S&W 686-3 6" Wheelgunner.

First time on the range I tried to fix the sight for my eyes.
I was totally confused and gave it up after a while.

I phoned a buddy of mine, knowing he shoots a 686 for a couple of years and he told me what´s up.

But it´s still tricky.
Now I have a couple of guns, and every time I have to change the sight adjustment I must afflict my ol´brain. :roll:


If somebody in here needs a translator for german gun stuff, send me a PM.

You´re always welcome,
J.

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guns

Post by Pete D. » Tue Feb 09, 2010 5:23 am

Kimber, Gold Cup, Springfield. Pick one. They are all good. I own a GC and Springer loaded. My buddy shoots the Kimber.
They all work just fine. I do most of my shooting with the GC.
Pete

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Post by perazzi » Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:21 pm

I remember those days! Going from my Winnie '52 with the Redfield International sights to my Annie 54 Match with the Annie sights..

I could put bullet holes everywhere but the right place.... :lol:
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Re: 45 cal. 1911 purchase

Post by ronn » Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:37 pm

I replaced a Colt Gold Cup with a Kimber II, best move I made. Kimber is extremely accurate and dependable - but need trigger work. Since then bought a Kimber Target Match which does not have the II safety. Another great bullseye gun, but the trigger was terrible. Sent it back to Kimber with the 5.5# trigger and got it returned with a 4.5#. Gave up on Kimber's lousy custom shop and now have a clean 3.5, and a beautiful gun. ALSO when it was returned from Kimber there was a large nick in the slide that was not there when returned. Love Kimber guns, but not the service they offer after the purchase. They appologized to me at the annual NRA show which was nice, but did not correct anything other than they sent me 2 slide springs which are useless in a wad gun.

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Gold cup

Post by gcp » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:04 pm

Don't know about the modern day Gold Cups but I wouldn't sell/replace my 1967 National Match because it's by far my favored 45 ACP.

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perazzi
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Post by perazzi » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:24 pm

Nice GC, someday my new one will be as nice as your old one... :wink:

Were they still giving you a target back then??
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